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----- Original Message -----
To: AJ
Sent: 07 November 2001 21:50
Subject: Re: Christianity
Hello fellow freethinker,
Thank you for your thoughts. I do have some sympathy with what you say and
used to think even closer to the idea that one needs to address emotion more and
rationality less. However my time spent looking into the hundreds of
deconversion stories I have read and discussions with other ex-Christians
has revised my opinions somewhat.
As can be seen from many of the stories you can read via my site, the
surprise is that it frequently actually is rational argument that convinces
people that Christianity is unwarranted, rather than emotional reasons. It
may be hard to believe that a fundamentalist could be swayed by rational
argument and it is rare indeed that rational argument brings a sudden
realisation. However, the fact remains that I have spoken to many previously
impervious hard line fundies who are now freethinkers. Such people often report
a growing cognitive dissonance within their Christian thought until the bubble
bursts - a process that usually takes years of study - usually of the bible and
Christian ideas, but also chewing over arguments they have been given from
outside. On the ex-tian list, some have written that they really should thank so
and so for putting forward an argument that started them thinking. So, it
certainly isn't irrelevant to debate, and if you wish I can send you
accounts of people who have deconverted directly through debate as well as
many of those for whom debate/discussion was an important factor (as it was
for me), even if not the only element.
Also I don't want to emotionalise anybody into or out of a belief, and
so rational discussion is the only way of opening eyes honestly. We can and
should describe our inner feelings, but whether atheism makes us feel
better or not, the bottom line still remains - is Christianity (or another
religion) a tenable belief when scrutinised?
Nevertheless, it is quite right to discuss the emotional and spiritual
aspects of life for those of us without religion as there is plenty of
misinformation spread around churches that those without a religion/Jesus are
empty and nihilistic. Although this is something I would like to address
more fully, I feel you have been a little unfair on me as I do mention this at a
number of places. For instance, even in my "testimony" at http://www.users.globalnet.co.uk/~slocks/why.html I
wrote:
"I was kept back though by the feeling that as Thomas Merton said "by
denying God we are denying ourselves." If I wasn't a Christian I would be
missing something important in life, therefore there had to be something in
it...I had thought that we only become fully human by believing in God, and now
one of the deepest human experiences was only possible for me if I didn't
believe in God, or at least didn't believe in the afterlife. How could this be?
...I had allowed myself to ask if Christianity made more sense, and was at
least equally rich if it was not of God, and overwhelmingly this was what I
found...Due to my total change of world view I also had some very weird
experiences that were not like anything I had expected. I was struck enormously
by what I called "existential shock." I was completely amazed at the mere fact
of existence. Not in a "wow that's impressive" manner but in a feeling that I
only had religious words for. It was being struck by the amazing "sacrament" of
life - or the utter shock and opportunity of existence over its alternative. It
was totally numinous and an almost disturbing feeling that existence is the
case. I felt transformed, awed, excited - the whole world seemed more special
than can ever be said. Life was far more poignant without Christianity than it
had ever been with it. I was not expecting this to happen to me. I thought these
experiences were what converted people to religion, not what you got when you
left!"
Now I've said all that, I also want to remark that deconverting
Christians is not what my site is about, the appearance of my feedback to the
contrary! When I started getting criticisms from Christians my heart sank,
as that is not what I wanted to spend my evenings in debate over. Instead
my site is primarily a resource for new ex-Christians (and the not so new) so
that they can know they are not alone. I get plenty of appreciative emails from
such people and so I know it is a success in doing exactly what I
originally aimed. i.e. what would I like to have stumbled across
when I was a new ex-Christian?
You wrote
<< If you truly want to deconvert people you need to come up
with some sort of atheist/freethinking
ideology that could sway people's
emotions the way religions do. You need to
show people that
atheist/freethinkers can have more powerful and profound
experiences in ways
religion couldn't even begin to imagine. >>
Have you had any luck with this? Also how do you feel about the importance
of having a rational approach to beliefs that is strong enough not to be swayed
by emotions? As great as life enhancing experiences are, in "Everyday Ecstasy"
Marghanita Laski points out the actual and potential results of reliance on
ecstasy or mystical experience as contrasted with conduct based on reason and
analysis. I think that goes for the connection that plenty of atheists also
report (and as are described by Laski) in that we still need reason to be our
guide, even if great feelings are inspirational.
I'm the last one to want to be a cold fish, but at the same time I am
worried about the dangers of emotionalism or too much reliance on
feelings.
That's it! Thanks for your input.
Regards,
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